How Should I Teach Lightroom?

Weird title for a post huh? After reading some comments from yesterday’s Before/After video with a Black and White example, it got me thinking. A few people commented that the video was a disappointment because not much of the work was done in Lightroom (and it used a 3rd party plug-in). Some even went as far as saying it was a promo for the plug-in. It was odd for me to read that because I was just showing the way I do it and what kind of technologies I’m excited about. So I figured I’d ask you. Not because the comments were so overwhelming (there were only a few). But because I’m genuinely curious. Sure, this is a free blog and I get to control the content so I could teach whatever I want. But let’s be honest – the blog is also exposure for me. I hope that by reading it, you’ll find ways to add income for me and the company I work for.

So how should I teach Lightroom? One of the best scenarios is yesterday’s video. I use a plug-in that costs nearly $200 if purchased alone (which shall remain nameless so I don’t get called a shill, sell-out, and all the other nifty names that come up should we mention another product that costs $$) :)

Some videos I do have a lot of Lightroom involved and some don’t. Do you want me to hand-pick the ones that make a good LR demo and just show those? I guess I always felt my job is to show you what I actually do with my photos. Let’s face it, the Develop module in Lightroom isn’t rocket science – it’s pretty straightforward once you learn your way around the Basic panel at the top (the main sliders). I always kinda felt the value in the videos was the creative aspect of how to tackle a photo and what things I look for when developing it. Isn’t my job is to show you what I’ve found works best with my own photos? That’s why you’re here right?. You wouldn’t attend one of my workshops or seminars and watch me do something to my photo, and then come up and say “Well Mr. Kloskowski…” (which by the way, I always know its going to be a doozie of a comment when some one calls me mister), “Couldn’t you also do that using” – and continue to describe some other method that you’d learned from some Youtube video a while back. Now, some of you probably would. But I’d give you the same answer I give everyone who asks that question, “Yep, but this is the way I do it”. You didn’t pay me to teach (or reassure) you what you already knew. You paid me because you trust the way I do things and want to see how I do them. And the audience didn’t pay to hear the way you do it, they paid to hear the way that I do.

So the question remains. How should I teach Lightroom? If there’s two ways to do something, what do I do? And if a plug-in that costs money is involved (and I use it and it’s something that I would use even if I owned my own studio/business), should I show it? Or should I just stick to doing everything the semi-free way and assume you’re only going to have Lightroom and Photoshop? You guys pick and I’ll follow.

A few ground rules: You have to pick a side. You can’t say, “teach us all the ways so we can choose”. My videos would take forever and I’d get very little done. And it’s just not fun when you have to show people 3 ways to do the same thing. So please either pick the “Show us the way you do it” side, or the “Show us the free way” side.

So have at it and let me know what you think? Thanks :)

Author: Matt K

Matt is a full time Education Director for the NAPP and Kelby Training. He's a best-selling author of various books on Photoshop and Photography co-hosts the live weekly photography talk show "The Grid" and is co-host of "Photoshop User TV". In his spare time he practices as a 1st degree black belt in Taekwondo and enjoys spending time with his family in Tampa, FL.

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236 Comments

  1. I’m a new reader and new lightroom user. By all means show how You do it. If something costs money I can’t afford it, then I’m disappointed. However, I usually bookmark things for when I can afford it.
    Thanks!
    Your post made me laugh {in a good way} asking our opinions while telling us which side you really really want us to choose.

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    • This is a vote for Show How You Do It.

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  2. Matt,
    I read some of those comments yesterday and was disappointed. Why do some people criticize your post because you show a third party plug-in? Unreal. I have always enjoyed your posts, checking your blog nearly every day. Some items haven’t really interested me so I just skim them; others have been very useful. I appreciate you showing me WHAT YOU USE because after all, my goal is to deliver the best product in the most efficient manner possible. If that means a $200 plug-in then so be it. I’ve never understood the people who are such “purists” that they wouldn’t use a plug-in? Or are too cheap to spend money for a product that will enhance their work, improve their productivity and in the end, make them money?
    My vote is for you to continue to show me what you do, what products you use and how you use them. I imagine that coming up with “Lightroom Killer Tips” would become increasingly more difficult if your hands were tied to Lightroom only. Next it will be “don’t use so much Photoshop, this is a Lightroom site”!
    Thanks for your efforts and your work. My use and understanding of Lightroom has increased by reading your blog.

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    • Well said!!! I have to agree with SteveB. Couldn’t have said it better.
      Matt, I commented thanks for your video on the fan pg in facebook of NAPP. I for one am happy that you include the plug-in part, as I have been considering using this for my business & wondering if it would be worth the expense. So if I can turn it around easy, good looking b/w images & start making money for myself, hooray for me & thanks to you for making this video lesson!!!

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    • Amen to you…..You said exactly what I was thinking. Matt has opened up new worlds to me many times over. I love to learn new things and investigate new products…Matt—keep doing what you do. Your fans love you…..see you in Nevada.

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    • I’m on the “Show us the way you do it” side. :) Keep on going the way you do!

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  3. I think that the video was one of the best you have done. You cannot leave out a plug-in just because some people don’t have it. I use LR and PS and some plug-ins. I have learned a lot about the integration of LR and PS from your instruction, and the addition of a plug-in to the mix is very helpful to me.

    I recommend that you continue to teach as you have been doing. The naysayers should recognize that 95% or more of your content does not include plug-ins. If this one video does not work for them, then they can turn to any one of the others. After all, this is not personalized instruction. If it was, it would not be free.

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  4. Yes it is disappointing when the tutorials are all done in something other than lightroom. I liked learning about the nik stuff yesterday and was more disappointed when I found out they had a lightroom plugin and you used the photoshop plugin. I believe you should use lightroom plugins when possible.

    Saying that I think you should show two ways to achieve the same result if you personally cannot be a lightroom purist. However, I believe most people cannot continually be putting money in software. They bought lightroom now they need to stick with it. maybe if we stay more lightroom pure it will force adobe to add these extras onto lightroom instead of us needing to buy lots of plugins.

    yesterdays video was good but believe you could have showed us two ways. One using lightroom>disaturating>adjusting to come up with the best look. Then you could show us the plug in in lightroom that would do it also. That way we could see that it could be achieved two ways one using just lightroom and the other spending a little money.

    Yesterdays video did seem to say here is the way to do it in lightroom however your pictures will never be as good unless you use this plug in and this is the best way to do it.

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    • I think you are totally out of whack on this. If you do things a certain way already you need to start your own blog and do it that way.

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  5. Well.. That’s a big question mark there..
    Mmm.. Just my humble opinion..
    Maybe you can what you did first.. I mean your workflow; What software/plug-in you used.. Then after that just show on how to achieve the similar or nearly similar to what you’ve done previously.. At least its fair enough for people who doesn’t have the software/plug-in.. Anyway.. its just a thought..

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  6. Matt. I’ve been following your blog for a long time, but this really made me leave a comment for the first time.

    Please do not change a thing about what you’ve been doing. It is true that sometimes it doesn’t make sense for me to purchase some of the tools that you use, but when I do need them, I’ll at least know what’s available.

    People will always complain.

    Thank you very much for a great site. Maybe I should post more to show my appreciations for your blog to compensate for some of the complains you’ve been getting.

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    • Jason nailed it!
      I have this page on RSS and always look forward to the (1) lettn me know there’s a new post by you. I know I’ll always learn something, and could care less if it’s about LR/ a plugin/ Nikon gear/ or marriage advice.
      It’s your page man, do what feels right. Let the “purists” go make their own page.

      Do another on plugins next time just for fun!

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    • I third Jason’s feelings! I didn’t read thru all the comments but all I can say is…”Keep doing what your doing!!” This blog, along with Scott Kelbys, Chase Jarvis, & Joe McNallys is the best, honest, accurate, and helpful pages that I’ve found out there!
      Thanks for all you do and I’ve learned an amazing amount of useful things(whether it is about something in LR ,a Plugin, in Bridge, Camera Raw, or something on my Camera.
      Keep your chin up and looking forward to the next post! :)

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  7. While I usually can’t afford the plug-ins you mention (at least not right now), I would rather you show how you do things (including expensive plug-ins). Even though I can’t afford those plug-ins right now, if I don’t know about them, why would I ever decide to buy them when I can afford them. Maybe seeing how versatile or advantageous a plug-in is may make me decide to purchase a plug-in instead of a new lens.

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  8. Matt,
    For the most part, love your stuff. To me, yesterday’s was only slightly disappointing. NOT that i didn’t want to learn about the plug-in, but that you didn’t spend justice time in LR doing the black and white. Maybe it’s just web video resolution, but i didn’t really see anything super great about the plug-in that couldn’t produce similar results in LR. Maybe the proof is in the print.

    If anybody’s seen some of those online photo webinars, THOSE are plugs for crap. I felt you were genuinely excited about this product and wanted to share.

    Thanks. Keep up the good work.

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  9. How about teaching us the Lightroom only way first and then show us the “short-cut” way if there is a plugin or 3-rd party app.

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  10. Recently there has been a high number of video’s that have been predominantly Photoshop tutorials. I wouldn’t want to see them vanish completely, but I would like to see more that are focused on just lightroom. As for showing plug-ins, I think its great to be shown what can be achieved by someone who knows.

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  11. Honestly, it is your blog and you can teach any way you want to. I find 99% of what you teach, helpful. When you begin to discuss products that I don’t use, and may never use (primarily because of price – come on $200 for a B&W plug-in) I simply end the video.

    In reference to SteveB’s comment about people being too cheap to pay for a plug-in that will enhance their work, I say, people look for value in what they buy. I venture to guess that most people here are not professional photographers, graphic designers or artists and have to pick and choose their products carefully.

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  12. Hi Matt, What you are dealing with(as I know you are aware of) is a broad audience with varying skills in lightroom. I am new to lightroom and when I read about an expert using a plugin then I assume that LR can not get the job done effectively other wise you would not be using a plugin. I appreciate whatever advice anyone is willing to offer even if it is about a different product that I may or may not want to purchase someday. Please don’t let the criticism stop you from posting what you are excited about.

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  13. Hi Matt

    I’ve not read the previous comments in order to give you my honest reply without being pulled one way or another by other commenters on this blog.

    I think you need to come back to what this blog is about and what it is named. The site is called lightroomkillertips.com not mattKloskowskiswayofeditingphotos.com

    I think the video tutorials you provide are excellent and I dont mind what plugins and software you use, however could these be put somewhere else?

    Why not keep the direction of your blog lightroom speciic, a single authoritive sourse of lightroom specific tutorials and videos.

    Just my two cents.

    Rich

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    • Sometimes using a plugin -is- the tip. Theres nothing wrong with that.

      RC

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      • I agree with RC. If you add a little explanation of why you use the plugin, so we can see the value, that would be very helpful. I read your blog because I want to know how you use your tools. Oh, and because it’s well-written and great fun, too!

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      • Amen RC.

        Matt-

        after my post yesterday I think you know where I stand. if I wanted to strictly learn LR only then I would crack open the book. when i visit your sight i expect to see new, unique, and time saving methods that can improve my work and efficiency. i don’t care if you mention Nik, onOne, or anyone else, because if it gets the job done if half the time then it’s worth the money. knowing a simple trick to quickly edit my images would give me more time to sell those images. a true professional who visits your site could quickly make-up $200 with one solid 11×14 print. also, don’t waste your time making one video for the photoshop plugin, one for the LR, and one for appleAp. if the users aren’t smart enough to get the jist of your video and directions then they have a lot more to learn outside of LR and plug-ins.

        if i wanted to read the same old things about lightroom and nothing about plug-ins then i would just crack open Scott’s book (no offense Scott, but books can’t be updated daily). i totally expect to see something cutting edge or insightful when i visit your site, Matt. i would assume that if you tailored your site to cater the displeased of yesterdays post that you would lose some of your most loyal followers.

        there’s a reason that plug-ins like Nik and onOne win awards, because they’re helpful. they continue to show-up on photog must have lists. if someone can’t afford those items then they need to shoot one more event or download the demo to see if it would be worth the purchase.

        i’m encouraging you to please continue doing what you’re doing and forget about the cheapa$$ purists from yesterday. you’ve shown practically everything you can within stand alone LR over the past few years. if they don’t have it by now there’s always the previous button on your posts to go back or they can sign-up for Kelby Training.

        -brad in NC

        (i would like to recommend you make a preset library link on your homepage! now, that would be really helpful)

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    • When I log on to lightroom killer tips, it is because I want to see lightroom killer tips.

      It’s that simple.

      If the purpose of the site is to highlight Matt’s digital processing techniques, that is a wonderful thing too! Just change the name and have someone else do a site on lightroom. That way, everyone knows what they are getting.

      BTW, your statement: So please either pick the “Show us the way you do it” side, or the “Show us the free way” side—betrays how you view those who using Lightroom for their sole post processing software. Lightroom is not free and not a trivial cost for many.

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      • Yep, it’s a Lightroom blog, not a photoshop blog.

        I think that is the point of those that feel less positive about the photoshop stuff.

        If it’s not just a Lightroom blog, then change the name. :)

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  14. There are tens, if not hundreds of books, tutorials and movie clips that show how to use Lightroom. For me, what makes your posts stand apart from the crowd is that you talk about how YOU use Lightroom. I consider myself to be an accomplished Lightroom user. I follow your blog because I like your work and I am always interested to see if you use the tools in a new and interesting way.

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  15. Matt, your teaching style is what brings me to your blog. I attended your Lightroom Seminar in Covington, KY last year and learned so much that I started reading your blog regularly.

    Some people who use Lightroom don’t have Photoshop. Does this mean you shouldn’t demonstrate techinques that jump into Photoshop either?!?! Obviously not.

    Please continue to show us how you do things both in Lightroom and via plug-ins. It is really helpful to see how you get the looks you achieve in your photos, even with plug-ins.

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  16. Matt – Please keep doing what you are doing. There will always be those who will criticize and will tell you how to do it “better”. I look in on your videos to see how YOU do things, not anyone else. If your workflow takes you to Photoshop and you use plug-ins, so what. That’s what I want to know. You clearly know what you are talking about and you are a good photographer. So I want to look over your shoulder to see how you go about completing a project. You may do it differently than I would but that’s okay. That’s how we all learn. Keep it up Matt. You’re doing a great job and you are VERY much appreciated.

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  17. Dear Mr Kloskowski, I’d say PLEASE continue the way you are doing it. Its great!! I thought it was great to see you use the $200 plugin as do I. Photography and postprocessing is not all about Lightroom. And yes on a certain point I guess LR is pretty exhausted in its topics to teach. Please Matt Go on!! I pick up so many usefull tips

    Cheers Vincent

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  18. Matt,
    I barely understand how people can criticize the usage of 3rd party plugins when we spend 1500$ (more or less) for a Photoshop + Lightroom copies. Your approach is perfectly acceptable. I would say up to the point to advertize GOOD plugins as long as it’s clear which ones are sponsoring the blog. Many people do that … and there is nothing wrong!
    What I would recommend you to increase people’s feedback is to explain WHY are you doing some steps. For example in the last video I noticed you gave the picture a new look by simply changing the crop orientation … simple to do, difficult to anticipate! :-)

    Best regards,
    Ale from Italy

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  19. Hey Matt………your Before/After B/W video yesterday was not a disappointment. People often get picky, especially when you are giving them something for free!!!!!!!

    I’m always learning something from your videos and I wouldn’t bother justifying yourself or your teaching methods to anyone.

    Just keep doing what you’re doing.

    BTW when are you guys coming downunder to Melbourne, Australia??

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  20. Mr. Kloskowski…” … heehe JUST kidding…. i am here to say i love the way you teach and that is the reason that i attended DOWN and Dirty, but then found out that you would not be there (orlando) and i would like to say YOU ROCK, i like the way that you show all the aspects of the program INCLUDING the plug-ins, if people are too cheap to buy plugins, they should stop being lazy and play around the program that they want to use….

    Personally, about the video yesterday, i loved it… i thought that it was packed with a lot of information in a short amount of time, which is perfect for the busy person that wants to learn your techniques…. also thanks for exploring the plugin… i had not been able to master it well as of yet and it helped a lot!

    Remember … You can not please everyone…. and People will alway criticize things… but never get off their butt to do anything about it.!

    Thanks for doing the blog…. everything i know about lightroom is because of you and scott now after the down and dirty orlando.

    (also love the CD’s you done…. that i purchased there !

    YOU ROCK … Please dont get discouraged!

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  21. Mr. Kloskowski – :-)

    Please keep doin’ what your doin’.
    Your blogging is reaching a wide spectrum of LR minions – newbies like me, and old pros, as well. How can just one style fit all in every blog? It can’t.
    So, please continue to use your judgement, based upon feeback from your seminar students and other sources, to bing us the full-flavor of LR, enhanced by the mixture of 3rd party “spices”, just like a fine chef adds ingredients to the basic steak to make it delicious!!
    Thanks for all your efforts!!

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  22. I share your concern as I’m in the same position in a (Software Engineering) course that I teach. I use a plug-in that I find very useful, but would cost people several hundred dollars if they buy it.

    I’m up front and I tell students that I have a free license for the tool (the company gave it to me to gain more exposure for their product), but I’d buy it with my own money if they didn’t because I find it very useful. In the end students can evaluate whether the tool looks worth it to them or not.

    For the tool in question in your video, it exists as both a PS plugin as well as LR plugin. Pros/Cons of choosing one over the other?

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  23. I personally only have Lightroom – I don’t have the money for photoshop or the other plugins you use right now. However, I really appreciate every video that you do because I am storing all of those things in my mind for when I do get photoshop…it should make the transition a lot easier at that point. I have appreciated every tip and preset you’ve put up here for Lightroom – for example, adding watermarks to images. In the end, you’re putting up tutorials and training times for us to view for FREE so you’ll never hear me complaining about how you do it! Thanks for what you do.

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  24. Hi Matt,
    I really think you need to continue to do things they way you do them. That is why this blog is a daily read for me. I enjoy your videos and methods and see no reason why you should change them. As for the plug-in discussion, I learned very early that sometimes you really do just need to buy gear and software to achieve pro results. Nik and Onone both offer free trials to try before you buy, so you don’t have to shell out cash for anything that is new to you or may not care for. Keep up the good work Matt.

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  25. Matt,
    Keep on doing what you are doing. Thinking that everything that can be done inside Lightroom is ludicrous. I love Lightroom, but it is not the only tool out there. There are other things out there that work well with Lightroom, and it is nice to know about those, and how you fit them into your workflow. In the long run, it will help all of us.

    To know the software is to not only know the strengths, but its weaknesses too. To show us ways that work better at getting to a certain effect will ultimately help us all in the future.

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  26. Matt,

    Plain and simple…Keep doing things the way you are!
    Lightroom is as we all know an incredible piece of kit but it can’t do everything. If you’ve discovered a plug in that, in your opinion gives you richer black & white conversions then go for it and share it with us all. I for one would not have purchased Nik Silver Efex Pro had I not heard you mention it before (I think on Photoshop User TV) but geez am I glad you did. I absolutely love it!!! Hey, hold on a sec…there’s ways of generating a b&w built into Photoshop…how dare you promote a plug in..lol

    Seriously though Matt, please keep doing things the way you are. Yes this is your blog and yes you can put whatever content on here you see fit. We’ve all got our own minds so if you show us a plug in you use we can all make the decision to use it or not…simple; the main thing is atleast you’ve shown us what is available to us.

    There…I’ve said my bit :)
    Love the blog mate; keep it comin’

    All the best to you,
    Glyn

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  27. Matt,

    Not teaching about useful plugins would be like me not giving a patient all of their options when making a decision about their treatment. It is my responsibility to present the options so that they can make the best decision, not to prejudge whether or not a person will be able to afford the treatment.

    A plug in might be expensive but how are we to know if it is worth buying if we are not exposed to it?

    Joe

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  28. Matt:

    I personally find your methods and workflows easy to follow and very worthwhile to watch… If LR were a LR only package I could see people’s beef about not straying from LR at all… But the package is an ADOBE product (not a Photoshop Guys Product), and I am fairly sure that most Adobe products are made to integrate with each other and with plugins created by developers and end-users – most of which enhance the functionality of the Adobe product. (I for one could not live without some of the excellent Export plugins for LR – Like Jeffrey Friedl’s “Export to Zenfolio” Lightroom Plugin – WHOA!)

    Do it yer way and the rest will continue to follow… otherwise, someone else can start a LR ONLY tips show or videocast and take their time to do what you do.
    My 4 cents worth.

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    • LET ME GIVE SOME ADVICE TO THOSE POSTING HERE! DO NOT USE A WEBSITE LINK ALONG WITH YOUR POSTING…. I USED ONE HERE FOR MY MARCH 18, 9:35AM POST AND SOMEONE RE-USED MY LINK, MY NAME AND MY AVATAR PHOTO TO POST THEIR OWN COMMENTS SEVERAL TIMES. COWARD!

      EVERYTHING BELOW MY ORIGINAL 9:35AM ON MARCH 18 IS NOT EVEN FROM ME…. WHOEVER IS DOING IT PLEASE GET A LIFE AND POST YOUR OWN COMMENTS.

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  29. Yes disappointing. Mostly because if it were not for sponsors giving you their free plugins to try would you have spent the thousands of dollars on the plugins you have demoed? I am not afraid to spend good money on 3rd party plugins but to keep up with what you have shown us we would have spent a ton on plugins. If we all pullled together maybe adobe would start developing the healing brush and some of these third party plugs into LR. Let’s face it, they could do that if they wanted and then give us an app that really is an all encompassing place to make magic. Though your tips and tricks are great many times they require YET ANOTHER purchase just to try it out. Stick with a set of tools. How about if you actually spent the money on the apps and plugins you are going to use throughout the year then you might understand a little more you need to make one program the backbone and just a few other plugins. Right now it is lightroom and tons of plugins which alone would cost a mint.

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  30. Are you censoring comments on this so that the comments go your way?

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    • Kevin ,yeah thats it…I am sure Matt has so much time to censor comments in his favor

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  31. By all means Matt keep doing what YOU are doing. What you are showing here are some of the most popular and effective ways to create interesting and beautiful photography w/LR and if that means you use a third party plug-in so be it. You were using it in conjunction with the lightroom workflow anyway so it shouldn’ t be a big deal. This way we are exposed to other things/products that compliment LR and might make things easier that we don’t know about. I think its safe to say most of us appreciate the info given to us through this website and wouldn’t want a few sour comments affect the way you run your teaching style on YOUR site.

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  32. Matt,

    By all means, show us the way you do it. That’s why I pop by here!

    I’ve taken many of your classes online, read your Layers book (thanks for such a great read), and followed this site for I don’t know how long at this point. And I pop by here regularly for your take on how to work with Lightroom.

    Sorry to hear about yesterday’s comments. But I think you know, not everyone will be satisfied with everything we do. It does not mean we’re doing something wrong, we just can’t please everyone.

    This year I started doing workshops locally, including an HDR / Lightroom Workflow workshop. During a recent workshop I had the question, “Couldn’t I also produce those results doing it this way?” The answer I gave was yes, but this is how I manage the workflow. The answer was acceptable for the student and there was no griping. As a matter of fact, when we wrapped up he gave me the best review I’ve had from a participant.

    Keep up the great work, and I’ll definitely keep reading! Oh, and by the way, I deal with several external plugins to Lightroom, and I always want to know about the other options available. Thanks for sharing them with us!

    Rich

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  33. Matt, in my opinion you are doing a great job. Sorry for being so uncritically (=unconstructive) but I follow a lot of tutorial ressources on the web and I always liked yours because of the natural and genuine way you teach. Please don’t question your work too much. Don’t want to loose this ressource.

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  34. Matt…
    I read your blog because I want to know how you do it, and what you use. This way I learn both Lightroom techniques AND more about the cool plugins out there I should consider buying. Thanks and just be You.
    Marty

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  35. Please keep showing the way you do it, I feel it is much better that way. I like your site very much and find it very usefull, keep up the good work

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  36. I’m all for you continuing to “Show us the way you do it” . But I do think disclosure of any product you’re showing that is a sponsor, would be appropriate. Over the past couple of years I’ve noticed a tendency of all the PhotoshopTV guys to be very “promotional” about sponsor’s products. Especially Kelby. But I do especially enjoy your LR stuff, so keep it up.

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  37. Show us all of the ways. Paid or free, I can make up my mind if it is worth the money for the extra plugin you might use. I might not even know the software exists until you demo it. Keep up the great work!

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  38. I lear a great deal from your present modus operandi….please don’t restrict your content to LR only. The use of plugins in your work shows us their value.

    t

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  39. I love seeing your tips and have learned quite a bit from watching your videos. That said, I sometimes feel I’ve wasted my time when I watch a video only to find out that it requires an expensive plugin that I don’t own, since I won’t be able to get much out of the tutorial until I own that additional piece of software. However, I don’t think you should have to teach something that isn’t the way you do things. For me what would be most helpful is if I knew before watching the video what was going to be required to make the most of the tip. (Sort of like an ingredients list for a recipe). If you include in the post before the video, “requires NIK plugin”, I know to skip it since I don’t have those plugins yet. Bonus, it’ll make those posts easier to find when I eventually buy those plugins.

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    • Marcus,
      Great idea. There definitely needs to be a “requires ?? software” mentioned in the post ahead of time. That way, I don’t take your time up with something that you’re not going to be able to utilize.

      Thanks!
      – Matt K

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  40. Lr is not a magic bullet for photographic processing, but a bit more emphasis on it in a Lr tip maybe a tad more appropriate?

    As for the BW plug-in. Lr is not good for BW unless you like banding and PS is only slightly better. If you are into BW then a plug-in is the way to go unless Adobe suddenly makes LR3 conversion a whole heap better. There are alternatives to the “not to be named” plug-in, Power Retouche offer a decent one that is significantly cheaper, although not so user friendly.

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  41. Just a couple of thoughts running through my head:

    You should use lightroom plugins as much as possible
    ————————————————————–
    Why? I At the end of the day, all of this can just be a matter of preference and no one’s Lightroom “Pureness” will come into question if you happen to venture out of the box every now and again. Whenever we start taking a look at whether or not someone’s a “Purist”- we start turning software into an art form. It’s not. Lightroom is not Tai Chi. Lightroom is not Watercolor. It is not an Art form. Its a tool. I don’t call myself a “Dremel Purist” or a “Kleenex Purist” or a “Rubbermaid Purist”

    Insofar as showing one way, then showing the freebie way:
    ————————————————————–

    Again – why? I see this blog as a ‘tips’ blog – and not a ‘let me teach you everything you need to know’ blog. Hard as it may be to understand at times, but in some cases “Use this plugin” may just be the tip. Sometimes I think that the entire concept of the plugin is lost: Could you do something similar to the way a plugin can do something in Lightroom? Quite possibly. But the plugin makes it –easier- and saves your time. That may not be something you can appreciate if you are doing 1 and 2’s of pictures – which at that point you have the time to browse the net and figure out all of the interesting ways to do X . However, if I have a job/project/assignment/school project/favor I need to get done that has me working through 70 images, and projects like this come up for me frequently, you’d bet that plugin is the BEST way to do this.

    I also don’t think its a matter of fairness whether you show or don’t show that Lightroom can do it. If you’re looking at a tips site, you pretty much know Lightroom has a black and white section. To that, you know that it can produce B&Ws and that you can control it. His goal wasn’t to show “equal time” posting. He was showing “this is how I work with this situation” – seemed like a wedding.. Which would prob have a lot of pictures.. So he went the plugin route. You’d be surprised as to how many working people out there do just that.

    Not spending Justice Time in Lightroom also doesn’t make sense to me, and it always makes me think back to the conversations of “I need this to be really difficult for me to learn in Photoshop in order for me to feel it is a pro method” . With all due respect – we’re not making scotch here. Giving the software X amount of dedicated time to process something invariably means that it is X amount LESS time of you doing something else. Forget about the 300 picture workflow I mentioned previously. Wouldn’t you rather spend more time –shooting- the pictures you’re editing in Lightroom rather than focusing on the intricacies of how one slider affects something? That for me is why –SOMETIMES- the plugin could be a viable option.

    Arguing that Matt needs to change because the software is expensive, maybe free to review to some people, and unfair that you need to spend the money:
    ————————————————————–

    This is where I honestly believe you vote with your pocketbook. If you believe the software to be expensive – then all you need to do is not look at –this- tutorial and focus on the tons of other things he gives away for free. People go out there and evangelize these products as the best/fastest way to do things, not give you a financial proposition as to why you should spend X amount of money with them. That’s a decision that you should make on your own. Similarly – for the people who have –actually- purchased the product ; why would you make THEM feel guilty because they were able to? I’ve seen this out sometimes when you go to a camera workshop.

    Guy pulls out a really nice lens, and the people around him start with “MAN, wonder what you had to do for THAT. MAN, must be nice!! Man.. Isnt it good to be you.. “ Truth is- we’re not that guy. We have no right to guilt him for the purchase that he made, and we have no idea as to how we went about it. We only know what –WE- need to do to justify it to ourselves.

    High amount of videos that are Photoshop related:
    ————————————————————–

    Lightroom’s full name is Adobe Photoshop Lightroom – part of the Photoshop family. Youd be surprised as to how much you need Photoshop in your workflow when youre in Lightroom. You’d be equally surprised as to how small the Lightroom program ACTUALLY is – the rest of your experience becomes –style- . That’s the harder part.

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  42. Many of the sites have become one big commercial for products. If one follows just a few blogs and bought all the products it would cost them an arm and leg. What about starting a new blog Matt’s plugins where you could “advertise” for all your sponsors. Then show here how it could be done with LR. It is possible to reproduce what the third party plugins do with only Lightroom it just is not as quick or easy. Maybe if there was a deal where if you promoted a 3rd parties stuff they have to give at least 50% off to reader now you are attempting to even the playing field.

    Just try to keep in mind we don’t have the sponsors giving us the equipment, programs or plugins. What could you personally afford to spend on all that stuff?

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    • Not trying to be mean here.. really..

      An even simpler solution: You can vote with your wallet and -not- buy the software. When Matt starts showing something with a plugin just stop it and go to another post where he’ll likely give you free advice or a preset. I don’t personally think it’s fair to start asking -anyone- how they can afford something. They shouldnt have to justify their purchasing to you, and you’re invariably asking them to by making the statement. They’re evangelizing what the product brings to the table. The manufacturer sets its cost. And it’s up to you to make the determination.

      RC

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  43. Keep up the good work just the way you have been doing it! I too consider myself accomplished at Lightroom – why? Because I’ve followed your blog from day one (and read Scott Kelby’s book cover to cover more than once)! Sooner or later you will reach a dead end just teaching Lightroom (at least until 3.0 comes out) and the plug-ins and other methods you use to achieve your results are just what I need to know about to broaden my horizons as well. The fact that Lightroom plays well with other software is a feature worth exploring in itself. For those newbies out there who really do need to focus just on Lightroom techniques for starters – give them a link to a Lightroom from A-Z track of your previous posts and have them start reading from the beginning. Soon they’ll be up to speed and asking for more as well.

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  44. Matt, another vote for keeping the way you have been doing it. Don’t change a thing. I don’t usually comment, so I want to take this opportunity to say THANK YOU for sharing your knowledge with us for free. BTW, I am one of those in the minority that don’t know how to use Photoshop. Does that mean I should complain and you should not use Photoshop at all (and only Lightroom)? That Lightroom is already an expensive piece of software and I can’t afford Photoshop so you should keep to Lightroom. Of course not! You guys are the experts so show us how the experts do it.

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  45. You seek out a teacher to learn. What can that teacher offer, only their knowledge and that knowledge is gained by their experience and success in the field they are teaching. That means whatever tools and techniques they utilize are what they offer as examples to become accomplished in the endeavor.

    As an absurd example, why would I bring my watercolor kit to a photo course. In this technology driven digital photography age finding tools, techniques and help in using them means seeking others who have and learning from them. No single product can solve the demands needed today to produce high quality images.

    Teach what you use, what you feel works best, what best solves a problem with your manner of use…. that’s what students, followers and creatives willing to learn and grow will seek.

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  46. I think there’s a bug on your website. “papadoc” and his email address were already filled in to leave a comment.

    I left his there, as if this is a real bug, and not just some fluke, I don’t want my address shared with the next poster.

    KC

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  47. Perhaps some sort of balance can be reached. Personally, I can’t afford $1000 to get all the OnOne, Nik, Alien Skin, etc. plugins for LR and PS that you, Scott, Dave, RC, etc. all like to use. But, that doesn’t mean I don’t want to see how you achieve the results you do and how you get there. I might help to keep in mind the fact that many of us who want to learn how you do what you don’t just can’t afford all the slick tools to make life easier. So, in addition to showing what you do, perhaps the occasional “here’s what you can do native to LR and PS”. Then, compare that to how you can do better, faster with additional tools.

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    • Hey Ken:

      Doesn’t he do this now on the site? Not only that, doesn’t he give you all of the presets so that you don’t even HAVE to learn how to do it. You can just install it and click – you’re done.

      Maybe i’m missing something.. but there is a ton of free information in here.

      RC

      Post a Reply
      • RC,
        I totally agree! Matt provides great information and a few freebies along the way. He and Scott helped me through a college level photoshop course with their tips and tricks that the ‘professor’ just couldn’t communicate.

        And this blog has helped me master (somewhat :-) Light Room 2

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  48. I think there’s a third assumption that’s missing here: some of us don’t have, or actively use, Photoshop *GASP*!

    My personal preference, in MY workflow is Lightroom to plugin and home again. So I choose your use of Lightroom WITH plugins. How else am I going to know what’s out there, or even more, what they DO if someone doesn’t show me? I now own the entire Nik suite, largely because on a lot of Lightroom sites (including this one) you showed it in a workflow and I said “hey, that makes good sense!”

    I’m of a free mind, so if you do something with a plugin and it isn’t worth the plugin cost to me – then I don’t buy it. And if I do? I think you SHOULD get some sponsorship or credit for it’s use. Afterall, you took the time to show it off – you’re not making up what it can do, even if you were getting paid to shill it.

    So how do I want to see you teach Lightroom? Use lightroom and anything that is made to work with it – throw in PS too – but I know I like the stuff where it’s just sticking to the core program and plugins.

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  49. Matt,
    I am a regular reader of your post, but only occasionally feel motivated to comment. Well this is one of them. Curiosly I remember thinking as I watched the video that is seems infrequent that we see any use of LR beyond the basic panel. Oftentimes there is a quick jump to PS and sometimes a plugin. It got me wondering wether LR is more useful as a photo organizer than a post-processing editor. Then I realiazed what should be obvious; you were showing what you do for certain photos that make intereseting videos. Sure you can do B&W in LR, and I have seen that demonstrated many times before, why do I have to see it again. Who would watch a TV show week after week with the same storyline over and over again?

    I like to see different ways to process an image. Its up to me to decide what works for me and my budget. There seems to be this metality that ” If Matt does it this way then we all have to do it that way cause he’s our guru” and if our guru deviates from the box we put him in, then we have to set hime straight. This is bunk.

    BTW, what gets lost in all this is that you did make your way back to LR to show some further options after proceesing in PS and SEP, and how LR fits into the workflow. I say well done.

    Keep up the good work
    Jeff

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  50. Matt,

    I count on you and the rest of the Kelby gang to teach me how the pros are doing it. Please continue to provide me/us with the quality of training we’re used to from you. “I” like the Matt I’ve always gotten – not one that’s been bent by trolls. Keep up the great work man!

    Chris

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  51. Just keep doing things the way you have, the way you do it is just fine and I always learn something. If you use other software then so be it – it matters not. I’m just grateful for any ‘hands on’ tips and tricks for Lightroom, anything’s better than studying books. Keep up the good work very much appreciated!!

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  52. How about a better title for the post?

    I saw the title and thought the you had some really cool trick for doing BW, like the frames trick. Although frames and selective color should be outlawed, the technique behind them are what matters.

    Its your blog and you have enough readers that you will upset a few no matter what you do.

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  53. If he is only going to teach Lightroom, then you have to leave out any links to/and editing in Photoshop. Then I ask myself, why do I need to follow Matt’s blog. There are plenty of places to go to learn Lightroom on its own. I want to learn as much as possible the full gamut of what I can do with Lightroom, including any hooks into PS or any 3rd party plugins. If I cannot afford PS or the plugin which is demonstrated, then I have to find alternatives. Heavens, PS has a bunch of ways to achieve the same result within PS itself, so what’s wrong in using other plugins. It is by seeing the usage of products in blogs like Matts, that give me the knowlege about and the confidence to go out and buy them. So, to finish, keep on the trucking as your are. Best regards. Peter

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  54. Definitely show us your way of doing it. Personally, I like reading about great 3rd-party plug-ins you use so I can go check them out myself. Keep up the good work!

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  55. I think you’ve got the right approach! Keep on as you are used to. Then at least I will appreciate you, the tips and the blog.

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  56. I did not comment yesterday but I confess that I was struck by how small a part Lightroom played in it. If that’s your way of using Lightroom, okay, but I guess I expected more of an emphasis on Lightroom itself. My own methods involve using Lightroom for everything possible before going to Photoshop and I rarely do any further Lightroom work after Photoshop. You seem to jump back and forth between them. I use plug-ins too but, as has been observed, I wasn’t expecting a tutorial on using an add-on to Photoshop in a Lightroom tutorial. When you’re going ‘afield’ perhaps a title that alerted the viewer up front would avoid the clash between expectations and what was happening.

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  57. There are no sides to pick. Were the post title more explicit “my B/W workflow with Lightroom, Photoshop, and NIk” the choice to view would have been more explicit. [I clicked off at the NIK part, nothing against NIK]

    Secondly, this is your “blog” not “class”, as such you should should post that which you find interesting and let the viewer take what they need and leave the rest. Your analytics will tell you if you’re hitting your audience.

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  58. Hi Matt,

    Show all the tools you use. I love to see plugins being used so I can tell for myself if I want to buy them or not. I believe there are way more resources for people who want a “pure” Lightroom blog or tutorial than resources showing us the fancy stuff that’s available. I appreciate the sharing!

    Cheers!

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  59. First, I think RC, as a fellow NAPP/Kebly colleague, should keep his comments to himself. Of course he is going to agree with whatever Matt does—it would be bad business for him to offer an opinion otherwise.

    Second, I’ll quote a response I received for making a similar comment to one of Matt’s postings. I don’t know if was Matt himself, or a poser:
    “Dear KC,
    Sorry my free content is bothersome and inconvenient to you. I will promptly refund your money

    Have a great day!
    – Matt K (time waster)”
    http://lightroomkillertips.com/2009/video-saving-files-between-lr-and-photoshop/
    The purpose for posting this is: If Matt truly did write the reply, then why all of the sudden this turn around, worrying about what the ‘people’ think? If the attitude taken is that he’s doing this for “free” (which he isn’t—it’s part of his NAPP/Kelby job; but we get it for free), then none of us are allowed to whine about it. Same attitude should be taken here: It’s free, take it or leave it—don’t look a gift horse in the mouth.

    Third, there is already a site called “Photoshop Killer Tips” (also part of the Kelby community) so that make’s RC’s comment moot when he tries to justify Photoshop being used (heavily or not) because Lightroom is officially called “Photoshop Lightroom.”

    Fourth, I believe that when the website is called “Lightroom Killer Tips,” most would expect that the tips involved would be about Lightroom. My final opinion, and I’m sure RC will chime in that I’m not “taking sides:” If the tip involves anything other than lightroom, say so at the beginning. RC does an excellent job at designing Matt’s and Scott’s sites (no sarcasm there—he truly does a good job), I’m sure an additional few lines of CSS could be written so a subtitle could clearly explain or list that the entry/tip is using something other than Lightroom. For those of us who are struggling to make ends meet, it does little good to load up a video, only to find out that the “Lightroom” tip is really a plug for a plug-in—in another program, no less. Simply be up front with what you are doing. Interested parties will watch the video. Those who don’t have the software or the money to purchase the software will be notified up front, and can go about their business.

    Fifth, I watch the video yesterday, and washed it off. My immediate thought was: Oh, that’d be a nice piece of software to have, if I could afford it. My next thought was that I could accomplish nearly all of what Matt showed in Lightroom, and even Photoshop, if I had to. I understand that there are a few plug-ins that are, without question, hands-down better at accomplishing tasks than Lightroom or Photoshop. However, I’ve also noticed that both Matt and Scott tend to push plug-ins, when, like this one, it’s just as easy to accomplish with the tools at hand. There was no significant increase in quality or time that I noticed in yesterday’s post that would justify spending $200. With that said, I wish I could purchase the plug-ins that Matt and Scott use for image enlargement and sharpening—without a doubt, those are worth the money.

    In short, I didn’t care that Matt was using a plug-in. If I had known that—clearly—before loading the video, I wouldn’t have loaded the video. Problem solved.

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    • Hey KC:

      I responded to the comment below..

      Post a Reply
    • Arguing on the Internet is like competing in the Special Olympics.

      Even if you win, you’re still retarded.

      Post a Reply
  60. Keep doing what you are doing. I figure your blog is a place for you to show us YOUR workflow. That’s why I come here. And I guess it’s time to start experimenting with my copy of Nik SilverEffex Pro that came in the Nik bundle I bought last year. Thanks for the inspiration!

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  61. Please continue to do it the way you currently do, BUT please mention the plug-in and its competition in the same breath (eg. noise removal). Unless the tutorial is primarily not concerned with the plug-in, but with finishing the final product then stop there. However, if it is concerned with the heart of the tutorial, then please mention the Adobe way, otherwise the full impact of following along is lost for some. I think Scott use to walk the line very well in this manner.

    No one has purchased all of the plug-ins. Some of us only buy one when that great special/discount is presented to us. If you feel that the Adobe way is so involved and complicated and the plug-in gets around this hassle, so state. Then maybe a tutorial on why this plug-in is so valuable or why a Matt pre-set should be made. Then you can refer to it when you need to.

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  62. Hi Matt,

    This is an easy one. continue showing your favorite solutions. I have learned about plug-ins from your blog and Scott’s, and I use several of them. Plug-ins have been key to Photoshop for many years. And now there are Lightroom plug-ins. It would be great if everything were free, but it doesn’t work that way. Not to mention that Silver Efex rocks–it gives a true B&W darkroom look. I’ve been using it for quite a while.

    Keep up the good work.

    Jim

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  63. Matt,

    I’m on the side that says keep on doing what you’re doing because, in my opinion, you’re the best teacher in the business. Your presentations are well-prepared and delivered, and you make the subject matter interesting to your viewers. If that includes plug-ins, so much the better. I read your posts and watch your videos because I want to learn anything and everything that will improve my photography. It’s feel it’s better to include, rather than exclude, additional software that might enhance my photos. When you inform us about a plug-in that might be useful for a certain application, we are presented with a choice, then we can decide if we want to buy that software or not. I appreciate learning how you approach your photography because it gives me ideas on how to approach mine. Keep up the good work!

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  64. Please keep doing what you are doing. This is my first time posting on your blog but I have a been a reader for about a year now. I really enjoy the start-to-finish videos you do. I use LR and PS CS4, and even though I won’t be purchasing a $200 B&W plug-in, I like being exposed to what is out there so that I can make the decision as to whether or not I should invest in the plug-in/software.

    Thanks for all that you do on here and keep up the great work.

    My only request would be for you to post more frequently with your start-to-finish videos, I really enjoy them. :)

    Robert

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  65. Even though it’s “Lightroom Killer Tips”, I have no problem if you go off-message for a post or two or twelve. If it was a year of nothing but Nik plugins, then maybe look into changing the name :-) (but I’d still watch because I have Nik plugins) But honestly there haven’t been *that* many “Lightroom is just life support for Photoshop and associated tools” things lately.

    Speaking of Nik plugins, I think you folks in the KelbyCrew do a better job showing what can be done with the plugins than Nik’s videos. I’d love to see material from you folks on the ways ya’ll use things like Viveza, SFX Pro, etc. I feel I’m not getting the most out of the plugins, but just through sheer ignorance on my part.

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  66. Keep doing what you’re doing, mate.

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  67. I’ve always appreciated your videos (and other posts for that matter). As a new photographer it has been invaluable for me to see what you do both in and out of LR. Like you said, to see how a pro does it. To learn how to edit. So I say keep on keeping on. Thanks for all your hard work to teach us for free on this blog. It does not go unnoticed.

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  68. Matt,

    Perhaps it’s a perception thing. I for one am interested in your entire process and as you say, the way you tackle photos on the whole. So from that point of view, just keep doing what you do.

    That said, at the end of the day this site is called Killer Lightroom Tips so many people might just be here for Lightroom and Lightroom alone. I’m sure many people are looking for good Lightroom advice and might not be interested in anything more than that – hence the comments.

    For me, this site is more like your outlet to the world where you show us what you do – which doesn’t really match the title. I’m fine with that – your experience and talent is what I’m here for – but some might just want Ligthroom, Lightroom and more Lightroom.

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  69. Matt, I vote for the way you’ve been teaching; keep up the great work and the sharing of your workflow. If there is a plug-in involve so be it I use them as they make the time I spend processing images more efficient. There are people who will disagree with you no matter what you do so just speak what is in your heart to teach. Thank you for sharing your time and knowledge.

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  70. Matt keep doin’ what your doin’!

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  71. You would be shocked to see how many times we all disagree with one another on a daily basis. I use a Droid in a sea of Iphones, use HDR to create Harry Potter effects, and have Canon L glass in my office while I work on my Dell. I don’t agree with Matt because I’m his colleague. I just happen to disagree with you- and i’m coming from it as a Reader of his blog.

    For the first 3 minutes of the tutorial, he goes through how he would work on something in Lightroom, in Photoshop and goes through a Basic way of doing it in Lightroom – even specifying what sliders to use for the black and white here.

    Then he states “Thats not the way -I- do it”

    He also states “I’m not going to lie. SEP is 100 dollars. You’ve got to REALLY like black and white to spend the money on it. However if you like BW there’s no better conversion out there. And if its the kinda thing that you’re only doing a couple of times a year, you’re probably not going to make your money back”

    He then goes through 4 min of SEP, then goes back to talking about lightroom for another minute or so.

    So, the way I see it, he went through Lightroom as an option, then added a second option – one that he said he would use instead. He offered both choices telling you up front that it costs X, and that if it was something you did infrequently that it wasnt worth it.

    He didnt go through a value proposition to show you how even if you use it a COUPLE of times you needed to get it. He said “Dont get it”

    So.. because 45% of his video talked about his -preference- It didnt really matter that he did show two alternatives.. just that he talked about another program. Thats the part I dont understand.

    I think its an -awesome- idea to put in the beginning in CSS that a tutorial uses a plugin. Matt and i were just talking about how to implement that.. I think that one is KEY…

    However.. just as you can disagree with the content, I can disagree with your position. Thats not good or bad.. but just trying to keep it on the rails.

    RC

    Post a Reply
    • RC,

      Since Matt doesn’t seem to be using tagging feature in WordPress for anything else, it may be easy enough to change the labels in the template and add tags for each program used in a video. If tags are being used for some behind the scenes type stuff there are a number for WP plugins that use the custom fields that can be employed, or adapted to show the necessary ingredients for that particular tip.

      Let me know if I can be of any help. I love hacking WP.

      marcus

      Post a Reply
  72. Matt – You do a great job! Keep doing what you are doing and try to ignore those who somehow want only what they want, without regard for the many others who follow your blog. I really appreciate the time you put into sharing useful information with the rest of us.

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  73. As a veteran teacher of computer art and digital photography I commend your teaching skills. It is obvious that you have a wealth of knowledge and you know how to share your knowledge with others. I have been following your blog for a long time, and you consistently offer excellent instructions. I totally agree that you cannot cover every possible way of doing things — and showing your readers the way you do it is what I want to see. Thank-you and keep up the good work.

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  74. Dang, I like free, but I PREFER that you show us how YOU would do it– The real world isn’t free.
    keep doin’ what you are doin’!

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  75. Show 3rd party plug-ins. Lightroom itself is so simple it hardly needs a tutorial

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  76. Teach us the way you’d do it using what you think is the best or most efficient methods. I already know how I’d do it (right, wrong or indifferent) so I want to see a different viewpoint. If that involves PS and plug-ins fine. I’m likely to learn something new because you are showing me what you do and that may involve tools I’m not familiar with. Now, if I don’t like it then that is my choice not to like it. There are likely others who really did like it.

    As to the limits of a LR tips blog. I say the sky is the limit. What you demonstrated yesterday shows the power of LR and how you can easily use the tools available to a photographer to produce a result and have everything back in LR for management. Perfect!

    Thanks Matt for the effort you put in. It is appreciated!

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  77. Matt,

    I love your teaching style and the Free Presets! You have taught me so much about Lightroom. Really like the before and after videos. I want to know how you do things so please keep up the good work. Don’t get discouraged and don’t get bitter, just get busy with more videos!

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  78. Matt … continue being Matt and teaching the way Matt teaches … although, while you’re at it, perhaps you could demonstrate the use of multiple contrast exposures using multi-grade paper and a set of filters. Perhaps demonstrate the plug-in for that?

    BTW – I got a new plug-in for my developer tank to raise the temperature of my Rodinal so I don’t have to wait as long to get my film developed! ;-)

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  79. Matt:

    The only thing I would say is to potentially mention the plug-in in the title. For example, “How I create black and whites with Lightroom and Silver Efx.”

    But, it’s your blog…do what you want. I’m not complaining and I think that anyone who does needs a hobby. If you don’t like the content, that’s what that little red “x” (or red circle for all you cool Mac people) is for. Just turn it off, don’t complain.

    Keep up the great work.

    Kevin

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  80. Matt – keep doing what you do, which is great. I don’t have any plug ins, but from watching you use some of them it encourages me to look further into what’s available so I can then choose to spend my money or not. I enjoy this site and your videos and thanks for producing such great stuff.

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  81. Photography has always been a process involving multiple disciplines and tools in capturing and processing images. Photography isn’t just skilled use of a camera and processing isn’t just using a single piece of software over another. The key is knowing how to use multiple tools and techniques to achieve what you want. Even if I don’t shell out $200 for a black and white PS plugin KNOWING that that tool is out there is just another useful tool in my photoshop bat-utility-belt.

    Who knows, I may go to work for someone tomorrow who can afford a killer photoshop plugin and I’ll be a hero for simply saying… “Hey, I know just tool for that. Leave it to me.”

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  82. Keep it up Matt. Don’t yet have Photoshop, but will, eventually. Limited budget requires careful planning and use of funds, thus, I appreciate what I can learn by way of your tips and videos. One of the most important things is not to have to spend lots of time in looking for highly recommended (equipment, software, etc) to consider when the budget is ready. Thanks for giving us the opportunity to learn about what we have and what we may want/need to get.

    Looked at the before and after, but was not particularly moved — guess I’m not much on B/W, but thanks anyway.

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  83. Sheesh. How dismaying to read those snarky comments. You provide us with valuable (and free!) insight into how to best optimize our photos. I for one MOST enjoy seeing you work in the real world–LIghtroom, Photoshop, add-ins, the whole enchilada. I’m a big boy. I can decide if I want to invest in the tools you use or not. My only gripe is you can’t show even more add-ins! Yesterday’s post was particularly useful in that I’ve been debating whether or not I want to invest Nik’s plug-in. After viewing the video, I have a better idea whetherI want to invest or not. That’s value-add, if you ask me.

    If you’ve got a commercial tie in to a product your showing, then disclose that fact. Otherwise, please follow your gut instinct and continue to show us how you work with all the tools at your disposal.

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  84. My vote would be to continue doing it the way you have been. If there is something you present that uses a pricey plug-in I know I can either use the plug-in, find a work-around or blow off the tip. If I find I am blowing of more and more of the tips then I will stop watching. Your tips are free. They are for a very broad audience and nobody holds a gun at my head forcing me to watch.

    Keep up your good work.

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  85. Show us how you do it. No question. There’s lots out there on the easy way to do things the simple, I’m here for insights into how an advanced user uses the tools all together and what you’re seeing and thinking about the process.

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  86. When I found the website for first time, I wondered how much further can you go, as the power of Lightroom is somehow limited, and you can’t do much there (at least without plugins).
    After watching some of Videos, I like what you do, and the fact that you don’t limit yourself to Lightroom. The people who want to just use Lightroom may want to buy a Lightroom book instead !

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  87. Keep it up just as you have been pls! :)
    You can never please them all anyways, and to be fair, LR isn’t that much of a brainer, and it has it’s limitations. That is why I find it very useful to be informed about various plugins. I’m perfectly able to then do some investigation and find out if I want to spend my bucks on it or not.
    And I would assume that people complaining about free tips wouldn’t invest that much money in you or your associates anyways!? ;)

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  88. WOW. Some lively discussions going on here today.

    First, let me officially pick a side–Show us how YOU do it. What makes me read your blog, sit in your seminars, buy/recommend your books is your expertise. Anyone can Google for Lightroom quick fix recipes, I would prefer to see tutorials with context.

    Let me also comment as a fellow instructor, “better” & “best” are subjective. What’s best for me, isn’t necessarily best for my students. Talk to a hundred different Lightroom/Photoshop experts and you’ll probably get a variety of answers when it comes to completing the same task. The BENEFIT of reading your blog is getting insight into your workflow, which generates new ideas for my workflow. Sometimes, I think, “DAMN! I’m totally doing things THAT way.” or “Nice idea, but I would probably do this.” Either way, I’ve just benefited from you sharing your knowledge and experience. THAT is what keeps me coming back to your blog. Well written, immediately applicable knowledge related to a product I regularly use.

    Regarding the debate whether one should use plugins or not–

    Plugins vs No Plugins
    Lightroom vs Aperture
    Canon vs Nikon
    Mac vs Windows

    Remember, it’s not the tools you use, but how you choose to use the tools that truly makes the difference.

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  89. As a Lightroom user without the program, I would appreciate seeing how to do it in Lightroom but I wouldn’t have necessarily complained because as mentioned, it’s free! I can make the determination of whether I want to look into the plugin, or look elsewhere for a video that uses Lightroom. That doesn’t mean I don’t appreciate what’s provided here.

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  90. Hi Matt,
    if someone wants to learn what each slider does in LR, he/she can google it. The reason why I’m visiting your website is because I want to learn what techniques do you use and how do you process your photos. If you use some external plug-in, even if we have to pay for it, show us the way.

    So my opinion is SHOW us how YOU do it! We can always simulate the plug-in’s effect in Photoshop.

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  91. Matt, I’ve been monitoring LR blogs for years now and yours is on my top 10 sites! I use few plugins, but I do not mind seeing what tools a pro is using. Everything in life is about trade-off … the majority of us need to pick our tools (lenses, software, …).

    Yesterday’s video was fine and, as usual, well done. Since I do not do a lot of B&W, the plugin will not make my dream list for 2010!

    Continue your great work

    Christian

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  92. my opinion is that you do the right thing by showing how add in software work since that is an option which is supported by LR. if someone can’t afford to buy an add in software it could still be done at a slower pace in LR or PS.

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  93. Put me on the side of how you do it! That’s how I learn to do things that might be faster or better than what I’m doing and that means more time for me to do other things too! DO NOT CHANGE!!!! Thanks! Larry

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  94. Show us the way you do it!!!

    Surely this is a free source of info for us to read/use as or if we want it.
    If I paid $500 to read this to learn LR, and you spent half the time talking about 3rd party stuff to create an effect, then I could see the point of the disgruntled comments. But its free, its available at the click of a button.

    If a tip contains 3rd party software, it’s very useful to see (by watching your tips) if purchasing that software can help or improve my workflow.

    That can be a bigger tip than any, should i spend my money on this or that.

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  95. For me this is a no-brainer – keep on showing us how you do it.

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  96. It seems pretty straightforward to me.

    If the video is titled: “_________ in Lightroom”, then you use lightroom, and teach techniques IN Lightroom to what ever the above blank refers to.

    If you do a video called “______ with in Lightroom”
    Then you show us how you do something with a plug in.

    If I don’t have a given plug in, I don’t want to watch a video about how you use it (unless I’m considering getting it) So just let me know the video is about a plug in, and I can make my own choice about watching it or not based on my needs.

    But if I’m expecting a video about tricks in lightroom, and the tricks are all 3rd party, then yeah, I’m gonna be a bit bothered..
    (“Shill” is a bit strong.. I mean we all gotta eat…)

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  97. Matt,

    I love your teaching style. I find that it is easier to watch your video once and then practice, stopping the video where I want to try a process to see if I can duplicate what you are doing. I don’t think you need to change a thing. Would not be where I am without you and NAPP and Kelby Training

    Tom

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  98. Well Mr. Kloskowski…You asked, I been doing photography a number of years and have been using Photoshop a number of years along with Photo Mechanic until Lightroom arrived a few years ago. For where I’m at right now and the kind of photography I’m doing presently I’m trying to master Lightroom2 before Lightroom3
    gets out of bata, I think your Lightroom Killers Tips is the go to site,but am not interested in any thing else but prehaps more Quick Lightroom Killer Tips or Lightroom Killer Tips Light?

    I was going to suggest an “ingredients List” or “required software” but Marus beat me to it,Agree for the same reasons, plus it would make that tip easy to look up at a later date.

    Future plans are to attendt every Lightroom Workshop in Orlando next week.

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  99. Please keep doing it your way. If I want to know how to do it only in Lightroom I will buy a Lightroom book (which I have already done and now expand upon that info with your insights). One thought would to be to put a “warning” at the beginning of the post if it is not a pure LR post…this seems pretty silly!!!

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  100. Dear Matt!

    First of all, I’v “used” your site since the “early” days, and learnd a lot, and of course, somethings I do not read/ watch / find usable, but all in all I think it is a great site!

    Please keep up the good work, and show us how YOU use lightroom and give us tips about plu-ins and so on! Got to say it, its YOUR site, you can do whatever u want, and I think its great.

    Best regards
    JRJ

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  101. Matt: I think the way you finessed the issue yesterday was just fine.

    Other than the fact that you hopped to Photoshop to use the Nik plug-in rather than showing the Lightroom plug-in versions… I don’t have much of an issue with yesterday’s tutorial at all.

    You did show both the free approach (use the greyscale section in the develop module) in addition to showing the plug-in.

    Forget photoshop for a second (did I really just say that). But if you think about just Lightroom, you’ve got a $199.95 add-on for a $299 product. That may be much of the audience reaction. If you were showing how some $19 or $49 plug-in then you might have received less grief. But then again maybe not. Some folks are just cheap. Please remember that those folks who can’t afford any $$ for a plug-in are the same folks who aren’t going to spend money on you, KelbyTraining or NAPP.

    And you even spent time mentioning that it might only be worth buying if you do a lot of B&W conversions.

    You just can’t please everyone. Don’t bother trying. Just keep on doing what you are doing. Most of us will stick around. Those who don’t like it will leave. And that’ll be just fine.

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  102. Keep teaching us your way of working. It’s the best way to learn.
    Thanks for all your time.
    Rosanna

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  103. Matt:

    I truly believe there are always more ways (to coin the phrase) skin a cat….I believe your videos are very intuitive and I believe you should show the video how “You” would do it.

    If it involves 3rd party plugins that speed the tedious job of processing images – so be it!

    Also for those who are interested this is a software package called Adobe Photoshop Lightroom 2 last time I checked? So yes I would expect some round tripping in & out of Lightroom to Photoshop CS4 Extended, or to whatever version you are currently running on your machine.

    People this is about workflow and the more we can ease the time it takes to process our creative vision of each photo the better! We are photographers as well as Artists – Learn your trade and go out and shoot it- then spend some time under the hood learning everything and anything you can learn from people like Matt or Scott or the countless others who take the time to share their plethora of knowledge to make us Photographers better as a whole.

    Matt – I commend you and the rest of the NAPP’rs for the great job You do, providing this FREE service.

    Remember you are never going to make 100% of the people Happy 100% of the time…..But you sure are doing a Damn fine job of it!~

    My 2¢ worth

    A mighty THANK YOU!

    ~Mark~

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  104. Just keep doing what you’re doing!

    The only reason I’m using Lightroom is because I found this site. Thanks for all your hard work.

    – Matt

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  105. Matt, good rules for all bloggers:
    1. Do what you know.
    2. Follow your head and heart.
    3. Ignore all negative comments.

    Keep up the good work. The people that appreciate hearing your point of view will enjoy the benefits of you efforts.

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    • I’m with you & Matt & RC !!

      “Show us the way you do it”

      You can’t please everyone !!

      namaste ; o ))

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  106. Please show us the way you work on your photos in PS and LR and thanks for your tips and knowledge. Much appreciated!

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  107. Show us the way you do it. Love the before and after.

    Like to see good plug-ins and how you use them. Might be something I can use.

    If you were being paid to promote a plug-in and present it as one you use that would be different. I don’t think that is the case.

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  108. Well, if you make it down this far…

    You wrote, “Let’s face it, the Develop module in Lightroom isn’t rocket science – it’s pretty straightforward once you learn your way around the Basic panel at the top (the main sliders). I always kinda felt the value in the videos was the creative aspect of how to tackle a photo and what things I look for when developing it. Isn’t my job is to show you what I’ve found works best with my own photos? That’s why you’re here right?.”

    The Develop module may not be rocket science, but its subtleties often elude me. I don’t find Lightroom straightforward at all. Who ever selected the shortcut keys, the letters of which very often have no relationship to their function?

    I’m here to learn about Lightroom, not about plug-ins, PhotoShop, or anything else–there are plenty of resources for those. I can understand occasional highlighting of a particular plug-in you find helpful, but let’s face it Matt; your experience is nothing like that of most of your readers. You hob-knob with the Illuminati at Kelby, Adobe, etc. We cannot aspire to having the resources you take for granted in your environment.

    So I do want to know what you look for. I do want to see how to tackle problems. On the other hand, I want to know how *I* can do it; not how someone with myriad connections and who can dedicate full time to it does it.

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  109. Matt;
    The whiners who post negative opinions on your posts have obviously struck a nerve. I was in retail for 25 years and we had a saying “one percent of your customers give you 99 percent of your headaches”. Well in this case these nay sayers are not even customers. They’re “freebie” poachers who visit pages like yours looking for “how to’s” and when you demo a tool that they can’t get for free they whine, whine, whine! Don’t listen to them they are just a distraction.
    I love your style, I love your content. I want to thank you for your contribution to the photographic community. Keep up the good work.

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  110. Matt…. It was fine. Seeing NIK was OK too, but it might have been more fun seeing it work within Lightroom itself. Even though it isn’t the way you work. Thanks for all the good work!

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  111. Matt,im actually pissed that u even felt u had to cater to a few morons…bottom line the info you give is great,it is free and u teach it any way u damn well please.sorry to rant but you give some fools anonymity and a key board and they feel they can control a person like a program.i wish i had a button on my keyboard where i could force these fools to learn these complex programs totaly by themselves…nuff said

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    • Hey Al,
      This is actually something bigger than just yesterday’s video. I totally agree with you by the way. There were only 10 comments on that video so I’d have never dedicated my time and energy (and an entire blog post today) on the topic for just a few comments.

      This plug-in topic touches on something that, as a Photoshop trainer, I’ve run into quite a bit for years now. So I genuinely wanted the public’s opinion on this whole thing.

      Thanks.
      – Matt K

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  112. I know I value seeing any/all of the steps you do, regardless of whether they’re strictly in Lightroom, heavy into Photoshop, or occasionally (often?) in other plug-ins. I’m personally a Lightroom user, but don’t have Photoshop, and it helps me immensely to see visually in a video what you do and what tools you use to achieve your end result, so that I know what I can and can’t do in LR and what I could possibly achieve using other tools or plug-ins. I’m a fairly recent reader of your site, and I like exactly what you’ve been doing already in your tutorials, posts, and videos. Thanks for sharing them with all of us!

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  113. You give us these great tips for free, so do as you wish.

    Having said that I also wish to say, I would have loved to see how to achieve the same great results in Lightroom alone. Or how the Nik LR plug-in did the job.

    In any case, I really appreciate what you so freely share with us. And hope you continue to do so.

    Thanks, Matt, er. . . I mean Mr. Kloskowski.

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  114. I Love plug in’s but they are expensive. Show me way you do it so I don’t go out and buy a plug in that i’ve never seen work, and may not be what I need.

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  115. IHMO, this boils down to a misconception of what your blog is truly about. I subscribed to this feed because I wanted to learn how to use Lightroom. While I have learned a great deal, I have occasionally been discouraged by your integration of other software products like PS because the emphasis was no longer LR. If this blog was called Matt Kloskowski’s Killer Tips, then people would have some idea that this blog is about Matt’s workflow. In which case, introducing various the software packages and plugins you use in your workflow would not be a problem because that is what people are expecting. I think that new viewers of your blog are expecting you to talk about how to use LR to edit their photos. In short if you are going to continue to call this Lightroom Killer Tips, the emphasis really should be on LR.

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  116. Tell us the way you do it. If somebody doesn’t like it, and they think they know a better way that’s great; set up a blog and put it out there for people to learn from, just like you do. At the end of the day, you are providing us with information to develop our skills for free that we can either use or chose to ignore.

    I’ve followed your Lightroom In Depth course on Kelby Training, and a lot of what went into that has with appeared here for free over time, which any way you cut it is great value.

    Thanks for some great tips and tricks; a must read for Lightroom users everywhere.

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  117. Mr. Kloskowski…….. you ROCK.
    Keep doing what you’re doing.

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  118. Just a quick observation regarding human nature. And this seems to be a very general rule.

    If we try to tell others “how we do it”, they tend not to want “advice”. If we keep our techniques to ourselves, others want to know “how did you do that”?

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  119. I’ll admit I started watching the video yesterday with great interest because I really dig B&W photography but I stopped it shortly after you transferred it to Photoshop and started using the plugin. Can’t that plugin also be used inside of LightRoom? For me the blog is LightRoom Killer Tips so put me in the “Show us the free way” side.

    It’s not that I don’t want to learn how to use cool things in Photoshop and 3rd party plugins the big issue for me is I don’t have either of them and nor can I afford either one right now. Photoshop CS4 sells for about $700 on amazon so I’m all about learning to do as much as I possibly can to an image within LightRoom.

    Thanks for caring enough about your readers to ask us. You and Scott Kelby are a couple of class act guys.

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  120. Hi Matt,

    This is a Lightroom blog. That’s what it’s called. “Lightroom Killer Tips”. It is why I read it regularly – to find out how to do stuff in Lightroom.

    I find it’s value somewhat diminished when the posts jump into Photoshop, as they seem to be doing a lot more recently because I don’t have it (nor am I likely to at the costs in this part of the world, as much as I would like to have it).

    The video usually gets turned off when Photoshop kicks in and it does leave a sense of disappointment, because you are straying from your advertised topic – Lightroom.

    I persisted through yesterday’s movie and I did wonder whether there was a product placement fee there (not saying there was, just that it occurred to me). I also have wondered whether the more regular integration of Photoshop into the videos is because you are running out of stuff to show in Lightroom.

    I do wonder whether the blog should be called “Adobe Photo Management Tips”.

    ‘Just sayin’!

    Rob

    (p.s. Who is jgilbert@photoshopuser.com? Matt, I can get you your very own gmail address if you need one :) !!!)

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  121. Teach how you do it. LR is an ecosystem, not one program. The add-ins/extras are part of that ecosystem. I have found it useful to see what you use, and I have purchased some. It’s really easy to just skip a post I’m not interested in.

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  122. Matt. Keep doing what you are doing. If I dont have a specific plug in then oh well. I put it on my wish list and get it when I am able to get it. You have a gift. Keep on doing it the way you are doing it. I learn a good bit that way. Anyone who wants to tell you any different can create their own blog and do it that way.

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  123. Matt;
    Continue to show us “how you do it”. If, as an example, plug in’s make working with LR more productive, efficient and rewarding, than that is a good thing. I go to this website often to seek your expertise and thank you for the time and effort you make to share it with us!
    Best,
    Hank B

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  124. Matt,
    Please continue to show us how you do it. Frankly, I need to know how the pros do it. I enjoy all your tutorials. Don’t let the squeaky wheels get you down.

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  125. I think your doing great. Keep up the good work. I like knowing exactly how you do your photos. Continue keeping it real. All I can say if people don’t need the plugin don’t buy it. Matt’s just trying to keep it real and show you how he does things. He showed 2 different views of how to do it. Thanks Matt.

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  126. Show us the way you do it.

    You made very clear in the video that Silver Effects Pro isn’t for everyone and that it was expensive… you also showed the LR2 way to get to B&W. Keep making these awesome before and after videos. They are my favorite part of your blog.

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  127. Just do that thing you do !!!

    Really, you’re fine in your approach. It’s hard to keep everything purely LR feature oriented when the release cycles are kind of long anyway. Nothing wrong with showing integration with other tools and how they compare or complement each other… it’s all good :)

    PS – how people can feel cheated by getting something as free as clicking on a link and reading what someone else wrote is beyond my understanding; it’s not like you require a paid membership to read your writings…

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  128. My take… Let Matt be Matt.

    There’s too much whining… I would rather learn whatever I can from you Matt, whether it’s LR or anything else.

    Keep on doing what you’re doing.

    Cheers!

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  129. The way I look at: If Matt is willing to invest his time using and evaluating all the different options out there for techniques, plug-in etc and has found what he thinks is the best – why would I not want to take advantage of that? You’ve just same me time (and money) but doing the homework for me. Otherwise, I’m going to sift thru all the options and download the trials etc? this isn’t to say that I blindly follow his advice but if I’m into B&W and want the best possible – Matt’s turned me on to what he thinks is the best.
    People are crazy for complaining about “wasting their time” downloading or watching a video they couldn’t use. that’s a narrow minded, naive attitude toward learning. What, they’ve wasted 5 min? Skip one set of commercials watching the next Law & Order re-run and you’ve made the time back!
    Keep teaching Matt!

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  130. Teach what you know the way you’re doing. I expect you to show plugins you like and I expect it to be biased toward what you’re aware of. I also know expect you to teach your method. I’ve seen the same thing taught multiple ways on Kelby training by different people. I pick the one I like and go on. Same thing here.
    Thanks for your effort.

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  131. Keep doing it the way you have been. You have shown somethings that I thought were more apt to be Photoshop tips instead of Lightroom tips but I didn’t really mind. I may have been a little disappointed because I was hoping to learn an “all Lightroom” solution but not enough to complain about. If anything those things pointed out 1) a potential deficiency in Lightroom and 2) that maybe I know more than I think because your solution was the same as mine.

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  132. Show us the way you do things.

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  133. I would assume there are very good reasons for you to do what you do, so I would much rather see that and understand your reasoning than a purist LR only approach. If you use plug-ins, then show us your complete workflow and explain.

    As long as the plug-in is your personal choice due to its capabilities and not a means to simply “sell for a cut”, great. If you do get a cut, then be up front about it and the skepticism will disappear!

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  134. Teach it the way you think it should be done. I like having a look at what plugins can do. The more knowledge you can impart, the better.

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  135. Matt,
    5 seconds would have made a world of difference. Instead of labelling the blog entry, “Video – Lightroom Before/After for Black and Whites” name it something like, “Video – Using Nik Silver Efx to create your Black and Whites in LR”

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  136. Lets face it. Lightroom isn’t all that complicated. I’m amazed you (Matt) still find something interesting to say about it after all this time. I say, teach what you like, do what you like. I’d rather see (at this point in time) the different plug-ins and tricks to interfacing with other applications than see the little “menu short-cuts” and stuff of that nature. One thing you seem to be missing in your presentations is how to use it for printing…and not just simple desktop inkjet printing. I find Lightroom to be an outstanding printer interface for my large-format printing and very few of the amateur and even some professionals don’t seem to understand how to get the most out of their prints.

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    • If you know of some good tutorials from screen to print, I am in the process of purchasing a printer, considering th epson 2220, the 3880 is to pricey for me.

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  137. I welcome whatever tools you use, since I am not married to Lightroom. I just started using it after spending some time with Aperture and am very pleased with what it does. Someone else had recommended Silver Efex Pro and I downloaded the trial version and was pleased with the results. I am always looking for an easier way to do things and if the tool is available and I can afford it, I welcome it.

    Thanks for your contribution to the digital photographic community!

    Werner

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  138. I think that in general you should show us the way you do things. That is what I am here to learn, and when you use products other than Lightroom it helps me find other useful stuff out there and see what can be done. The issue for me is that it seems like lately most of the videos are only 10% Lightroom, 90% something else. If I don’t have these other products, then I’m not learning anything I can use. So absolutely, please keep showing us these other great things you can do in CS4, Nik, etc. But please also include videos that are mostly LR so those of use who have nothing but LR and maybe PS Elements can actually use some of the tips.

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  139. Well, you got 19 comments last time out but quite a few more this time. And I confess I haven’t read through all of them before writing this. At any rate, the two posts inspired two thoughts from me:

    First, there are always going to be people who are jealous of others’ success and take advantage of the anonymity that the Internet provides to use any opportunity to do what I think of as a “drive-by shooting.” If you’re putting yourself out there, this simply goes with the territory. Some criticisms are more valid and constructive than others; some are worthless.

    Second, as a fan of your work, I want to know how *you* do things, the tools you use, the thought processes behind that. I’ve been using Lightroom for a year, hit a wall and got Photoshop, which I’m starting to learn, and a big part of this process is looking to see which things I can do more easily or effectively in one program versus another.

    On the other hand, as some have commented, the blog is titled Lightroom Killer Tips and perhaps renaming the blog or starting a second blog might be in order.

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  140. I haven’t poured through the 157 comments because I don’t really care what others think about this. I/we owe Matt a lot for the information he dishes out, so I’m only responding to his request. I have to admit I find the need for Photoshop functionality to complete work started in Lightroom extremely disappointing. But this isn’t your fault, Matt. It’s the lack of photo editing functionality in Lightroom. As far as I’m concerned, it’s a scam that I can’t complete my work in Lightroom. I did notice, also, that the minor bit of editing you actually did in Photoshop could have been done with any old copy of Photoshop Elements, which happens to be what I use. (Mind you, I lose quite a few bits of information when I got to PE.) The problem is that Lightroom is reasonably priced; full-scale Photoshop is not (and the recent versions of Photoshop Elements are downright insulting to experienced photo retouchers). Before I cross Adobe’s palm with the coin they’re looking for (they already skinned me for Acrobat professional about 3 years ago), I’ll buy another lens. Adobe gets no points for their product release and feature-set strategies, especially from starving artists who need to live off creative suite that completely changes just about yearly. If I found another provider that came anywhere near Lightroom and respected Lightroom databases, I’d switch today.

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  141. As much as I would like to know what you actually do, anything other than LR really has no value to me since I can’t afford anything other than LR Beta & PSE (hopefully can afford LR at some point) and therefore wouldn’t be using the info.

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  142. I like the way you show us how to do things using different products. I love plug-ins and have a lot of them to save me time. I’d like it even better if you used different plug-ins as much as possible in your training. Appreciate everything you’ve done.
    Thanks

    Gary

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  143. Hi Matt!
    I have been watching your Lightroom Killer Tips for a couple of years now and apart from some DVDs I have purchased YOUR website is the place that keeps me up to date with things that go on in the LR World.
    I generally enjoy watching videos where you go to PS and then back to LR because that is the way I work as well. The best of borth worlds!
    Anyhow, why not showing every now and then that there are some other software products that might be interesting to one or the other?
    Personally I do not want to get crazy with too many options. I can imagine to grow old with LG&PS – I think they are a cute couple ;-)
    Thanks for your work!!!

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  144. Matt, another thought… perhaps you could re-name this site to “lightroom, photoshop, and any other associated software or plug-in tool that I use, could use, or would like to use, to edit my photos the way I want killer tips dot com… that would cover off most things I think. However, that would sure be a long URL to have to remember.

    All said with tongue firmly planted in cheek :)

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  145. You were doing fine…. don’t change your style!

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  146. Show us one way to do things–the one we are most likely to remember if we do not use Photoshop every day. Tell us about plug-ins that cost money, but only if they are something we are likely to use more than once.

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  147. Matt, I am very grateful for all you have taught me though out the last several years. You are a great teacher and that is the reason I seek you out, wether on the web or in person. If you just taught a generic way of processing photos, I would have no need to read your posts. I come here because you make me think of new ways to express myself though my photos. PLEASE DON’T CHANGE THE WAY YOU TEACH US.

    Thanks for all you do,
    Jack

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  148. Matt, quick vote for your current approach of teaching, including using $$ plugins. I think another effective thing you could do would be to help illustrate why one solution is better than another. I see a lot of industry statements like “our plugin X is THE best way to do operation Y”. For instance, I’d love to see an objective image comparison of a B&W conversion Silver Efex Pro did that couldn’t be done with Lightroom. Or if it could, how long did it take? Similarly, I’ve read statements like “LR’s noise reduction is just OK, but if you’re serious you’ll get Noise Ninja, or Define, or …”. Again, an image comparison of the two would be really useful. I think there would be constructive ways to do that without offending potential or current sponsors. Hope that helps.

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  149. Matt,
    You keep on doing what you do, the way you do it. Your work is phenomenal and if you use plug-ins, by all means teach us the ways and means. If someone doesn’t want to know about the awesome products that might make things easier or cooler, they don’t have to watch the video . If I were to consider purchasing a plug-in, it sure would be helpful to see a good one in action and know a little about it up front. I might not even know what a plug-in is was it not for teachers such as yourself. Heck, 2 months ago I didn’t even know what Lightroom was (the studio I worked in the past few years used Express Digital Darkroom) and now, thanks largely to your blog and your videos and a whole lot of experimenting, I have come leaps and bounds. I am so grateful that you share your experience and your knowledge with us.
    Don’t let negative people lead you to doubt yourself. There’s always gonna be someone that doesn’t know how to be appreciative of what you have to share. You are where you are for a reason. I check your blog almost daily not just for the new stuff, but the archives as well. You have shared so much- THANK YOU! I know eventually I will be able to make it to one of your classes and then I can thank you in person.

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  150. Matt,

    I personally think your 3rd paragraph said it best…teach the way you do things and let the “know it alls” go elsewhere! For me, I have much more respect for the photographer who picks what s/he considers to be the best tool for the job. That’s the way I like to work so I very much appreciate it when another photographer who’s opinion I respect and trust (like you!) tells/shows me how they work. I know how I work…maybe there’s a better way?

    Keep up the fantastic job you’re already doing and don’t worry about the hecklers!

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  151. Ok, so I have been reading some of the comments above and have one more thing to say. To all those who are complaining about the need for this to remain true to Lightroom and leave out anything else, especially those who say you should change the name to the likes of mattKloskowskiswayofeditingphotos.com or something similar, MAYBE THE LIGHTROOM KILLER TIP IS THAT THERE IS THIS REALLY COOL PRODUCT YOU CAN USE WITH LIGHTROOM TO FURTHER ENHANCE YOUR IMAGES. Why can’t people just appreciate the fact that you are sharing your trade secrets for free??

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  152. Guess the question you really need to ask is “Do you want to hear from all the YES people who read your blog because they already like you or would you like to have even a larger reader base? If your looking for the wealthy YES Men, you have heard from many of them above. If you want to gain more average readers who don’t have a grand to drop into lightroom then teach lightroom. The subscriber base to The Robb Report love what that magazine writes about and the advertisers market to. However, instead of a Honda car ad the advertisers are Ferrari and Rolls Royce.

    Now do you want to be The Robb Report and cater to the rich and wealthy or Killer Lightroom Tips that has a broader reader base?

    Isn’t part of the art learning what your doing? If it is all going to be done with plugins and quick and easy why not just hire someone to process your photos for you.

    “Here is how to make great b & w by hiring someone to do it for you” call john at 890-987-8907

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  153. Your way Matt. Though I think I know and use Lightroom pretty effectively, a good portion of which I have picked up starting with your first posting , I still always find something unique and useful from your postings.

    I don’t mind you pointing out other add ons and tools. Though I can not justify the expense right now, it’s good to know what is out there.

    Thanks

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  154. G’day Matt: Keep up the good work that you are doing at the moment. Show us the way you do things – even if we don’t wish to buy all the third party products at least our horizons are broadened and there is still quite a lot of basic Lightroom information

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  155. Matt,

    show us the way you would do it with the tools you would use. I have followed you quite awhile now love all the information you hand out.

    thanks

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  156. Keep it all coming. I’m a sponge that enjoys to learn everything.

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  157. You should definitely show us how you do it yourself. It is the very unique thing you gives us. Everywhere else I can find a book or tutorial about Lightroom and Photoshop and how I can do my editing by using those two programs or only Lightroom or only Photoshop. But your way of teaching gives me the possibility to widen my horizon, give me new ideas to how I can do things.

    The great thing about your videos is, that it is not determined by product (software) but by workflow.
    Of course Lightroom is the underlying basis, but that is also what is perfect about Lightroom, because it is a great library, editor etc., which can be used with a lot of different plug-ins. By showing us that, you basically show us how Lightroom can be used!

    Thank you very very much for great and UNIQUE videos!

    Greetings from Denmark!
    Jon

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  158. Matt,
    This sure got people to first think and then to make a comment. I liked the B/W video because it showed the free way and the way you do it. You have the time and resources to try things out and as you said, if you only do a couple of B/W a year it’s not worth it to buy the Nik software. I want the info so that I can make a decision with help from someone whose opinion I value. You have helped me with LR, PS, and other programs, so keep up the great work you do.
    Thanks
    PS I also bookmarked your web page to see your final pictures; another way to learn for me and hopefully some day some $$$ for you.

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  159. Hey Matt,

    Definitely show us your ways of doing things. You’re the professional and the teacher. I’m here to learn. Plug-ins or not, I want to know your workflow.

    Keep up the great work! Thanks!

    Steve

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  160. Hi Matt, You have the experience, the contacts and the up to date information on latest techniques and programs for photo processing. Please continue to show what you feel is the best method or an interesting technique that you approve of using what is available in the marketplace.Your time and effort is much appreciated by me . Thank you.

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  161. One of the reasons I read this blog is to learn about neat ways to do common things – and if a plug-in does it well, by all means, show me – easier than me having to download and try to figure it out on my own.

    Nothing wrong with that, in my mind…

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  162. Please continue to show us how you do it.
    Isn’t time to change the name of the Photoshop Guys to the Adobe Photography Guys as well all are using both Lightroom and Photoshop integrated

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  163. Matt, Please continue showing us the way you do it. You are a gifted teacher and your lessons have always helped me. So keep on doing it your way.

    Thanks for everything you do for the community.

    Dan
    Southfield, Michigan

    What is it about the web that brings out all the commenters with an ax to grind?

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  164. One of the reasons I use Lightroom is because it plays well with Photoshop and is designed to use Plug-ins like the one featured yesterday. I’ve seen you cover black and white conversions in Lightroom in the past. It was helpful to see a different way of doing it.

    Keep doing what you’ve been doing.

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  165. Matt,
    Keep doing what you have been doing. I come here not only to learn LR but also for inspiration. If I don’t have the pluggin that is ok I’m still inspired by the result and the knowledge of how YOU would do it. If I never see another way I never expand my horizons (even if I don’t have the specific software at least I know something like it is available and who knows I might have a client or a group of images where the pluggin is just the thing)….

    So in so many words Matt you teach us what you know (regardless of the specific tool) and we should promise to learn…. after all we are just sucking off your kindness for sharing your expertise… we could have to pay for it….

    Take care,

    Bob

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  166. I have read many of the response to this question and answer about Matt’s Lightroom tips. I frankly think some of the individuals are venting and not good reason at all. Matt Kloskowski provides a wonderful service to the public about Lightroom. I find his efforts well done and always interesting. I think most of all there is an honesty he presents to us. If you don’t like what he is presenting, you don’t have to watch him.

    He is a good teacher and be thankful for his efforts. I am a rookie in this lightroom
    arena and I have learned a lot from him. I always try to save a copy of the videos for organizing in some logical order so I can review them later. Sometimes the sequencing by date is useful, but putting ideas in folders relative to the video’s topics make more sense to me. Lately, it has been difficult to download the videos even though instructions are given to do so. Save as doesnt seem work any more.

    As a rookie in lightroom, Matt’s candor and honesty gives him a unique character in his teaching methods. I say to Matt, you are doing a great job and don’t listen to the “naysayers” – they will always be with you for the worst.

    Just a thought! Matt, I enjoy your site. Thank you.

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  167. Matt,

    I am on the side of keep doing what you are doing. I read some of the comments but I not all and I agree with RC that is if I just wanted to learn about LR I would get a book which I did but I like having an experienced photographers insight on how they do things along with the knowledge of the products you use. I would bet that most here have both products and if they do not now they will. So how you process your photos or any great photographer for that matter, is great knowledge for the rest of us. Thanks for what you do and I am on the side of leaving it the way it is, otherwise we will loose the insight and experience you have to offer.

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  168. Hi Matt. always loving the way you do it !!!! Keep going !!!

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  169. Hi Matt,

    This is a Lightroom blog. That’s what it’s called. “Lightroom Killer Tips”. It is why I read it regularly – to find out how to do stuff in Lightroom…

    Yes, many commenters have said those words, and I agree. It IS a Lightroom Killer Tips blog, and I want to learn everything about Lightroom – which means I want to learn about the basic panel, the noise remover, and yes, the plugins that add a dimension to the basic programme. While Lightroom is a great programme, we need to remember that it isn’t Photoshop – it can’t do / achieve everything that Photoshop can. It isn’t meant to. But, it is a programme that has the ability to use plugins which can give better results than the basic Lightroom can. If with Lightroom 1 you did a blog about the noise removal, commenting that it wasn’t that great in Lightroom, but was better using a plugin – you taught me 2 things – firstly, that Lightroom 1.0’s noise removal wasn’t that great, and secondly, that there is a way to achieve better noise removal.

    If I can’t afford the plugin right now, at least, I now know about the plugin, and have seen its capabilities. Thanks for that. I don’t want to have to spend hours on the web trawling for new programmes, and new ways of doing something. That’s why I come to your site – so that you can show me what is out there that improves on what I have. Because of your line of work, you have access to so many programmes that I don’t even know are out there – please keep introducing me to what’s new.

    So, having said all that, Matt, please keep teaching your way – which in a particular situation may – or may-not – include the use of a plugin.

    PS: Since I haven’t said it yet, Thanks for this site.

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  170. Matt, you are a great teacher. Keep up the good work !. The only thing I would love your screencasts have is a higher resolution.

    Regards from Spain

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  171. To make it short. forget the last few days and stay as you are. Teach as you did before. Everything was perfect until these comments came up. You know LR very well so I am happy to learn your way. If you use a plug in (cheap or expensive), I am interested in it. Why? Because there is a reason why you use it. So this helps me to get a better overview of LR and let me think out of the box (better out of LR).

    So that’s it.

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  172. Matt – whilst I wouldn’t want you to change what you do, the issue may have been around how it was presented.

    The title of your tutorial was “Lightroom Before/After for Black & Whites”. This does imply use of Lightroom for much of the tutorial.

    We all know you use a variety of tools including Lightroom (as do many of us probably) so perhaps a better title might have been “Black and White Workflow”?

    So keep doing what you do, but perhaps think about the post titles a bit?

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  173. Like many others I’ve followed this site for a long while and although my interest is principally LR techniques, I still want to know about other tools too. However, to be fair to the dissenters it may be a good idea to present a video in 2 halfs., ie., this is my preferred way with this great plug-in, but you can come close to the same effect in LR by doing this etc. This way you’d keep everyone happy. It may even give you ideas for further tutorials trying to emulate some other 3rd party effects too.

    I’ve tried Nik’s Siver Effects Pro and it’s very good, but with LR3 just around the corner, I like many others perhaps, am not going to fork out an additional 200 bucks at this moment in time until I’ve seen version 3. Perhaps this was about timing!

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  174. Your site is one of my “top sites” which I look at daily to see if there is a post. I have been doing so for a couple of years now. Teach us how you do things. It’s what brought us to your site in the first place. You are the “go to guy” for LR and I love seeing what you do.

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  175. Show YOUR workflow. That’s the whole point of having a blog and teaching. It’s about how YOU do it. Don’t be afraid to use other products if that’s how you roll.

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  176. Keep doing what you are doing. The more advanced and use of other products helps more advanced users. You are right that teaching over and over to beginners, doesn’t help everyone.

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  177. While I am not a huge user of lightroom as I mentioned in your previous tutorial, I think you do a terrific job in showing the masses how you do it. Any complainer should realize that there is another way to learn the ins and outs of lightroom…figure it out for themselves. It’s your blog, Matt. Keep up the great work!

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  178. Last I checked this is YOUR Blog, so feel free to do what you want to. I would rather come here for all aspects of photography and this is precisely what you do!

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  179. Matt- you are very dedicated to this blog-updating before you go on workshop tours that actually pay your bills. I think painting with a broad brush is definitely the way to go. Exposure (pun?) is always a good thing. Then folks can make their choice to follow your work flow or not. Your call, Matt. It is your show and folks will still follow. Do what you enjoy doing. It will show.

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  180. matt,
    many of us are pros,we work with several programs/plugins and its great to see how they all play well with each other. To me its all about workflow,how to get my job done easier,faster,and better. Yes starting with LR and going from there.

    LR killer tips,I have been a follower since the start, I find many of the tips are tips I may have forgotten or hearing it presented in a different way allows me to re-learn .

    Matt your stye is why I keep coming back…. thank you

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  181. Hello Matt,

    Thanks for the great tips, my vote would be to let us know your workflow, as that is what I came here in the first place.

    Keep up the good, and thanks for all the information that otherwise we would be paying big $$$$$$$$’s for otherwise.

    Thanks

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  182. Hi Matt,

    Love your work and I find your site a must read every time I’m on the computer. I have no issue with the way you do things, my vote would be to keep things as they are.

    My only suggestion is when you give short cut keys, it would be helpful if you also told us how to do that through the menu as well. I find it really hard to remember the hundreds of shortcut keys and think that if you said for example “to edit a photo in photoshop press command e or “edit” from the file menu and edit in photoshop”.

    Other than that, everything is great and I am looking forward to your next before and after!

    Have a great day.

    d

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  183. Matt, I really enjoy this blog. Even though I did bookmark it becase of it’s focus on Lightroom, I have no problems when you use any other software. Let’s face it, there is only so much that can be done in Lightroom. You can make photos look great with all of it’s tools, but to squeeze that extra bit of something out of it, you need to look elsewhere.

    When the overwhelming question is “Matt how do you do this?” you have no choice but to show us how YOU do it. If, however the question is more clear and and they add in “with Lightroom,” then you need to do it that way.

    I’d be willing to bet that the people complaining haven’t been following your blog for very long and/or never went through your archives. I wouldn’t worry about it too much though. The same thing happened over at the Strobist blog a little while back when DH began to talk about monolights. You would have thought that he was caught giving state’s secrets to Iran.

    If you must make a change to make most people happy, change the name of your blog and keep the format the same. That way those of us with more common sense can keep what we like and everybody else…well I really don’t care about them.

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  184. Matt ,
    FYI… when you leave a comment, the the last person who left a comment, their name and e-mail are being filled in …at least That is what I have experienced ( last response of suzi z )
    david

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  185. The website it called “Killer Tips” not “How to do it or i’ll Kill you”. People can choose not to learn the tips that involve outside applications. I like it as is!!!

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  186. Matt, as a non-professional, I am unlikely to buy much 3rd party software.
    My desire is to really learn more tips and tricks for the Adobe software I already possess. That being said, perhaps if you note in the lead in that you are going to be using 3rd party software that is only likely to be used by professionals, those who are uninterested can by-pass watching and/or downloading the demo video. I appreciate the time and effort you put into these demos and find them all useful (including the one that generated the brouhaha). Bottom line, show us the free way (although last time I looked, Lightroom was not free!).

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  187. Longest thread ever, and I didn’t find some keywords while searching it, so I’ll go ahead and leave a comment…

    There has been lot’s of discussion about photoshop, but one thing that was not mentioned at all was that when you go to Photoshop and back, you lose your history steps and gain an additional file. This is a breaking point in the workflow, a point of no return. If you want to change something you did before that point, you have to do the second part all over again, and that is bad. This leads me to my next point…

    Going into Photoshop loses the “paste previous settings” ability. There are a few things I used to do in Photoshop and I simply quit doing them and found alternative styles that didn’t require those actions because I want to be able to apply that style to a whole range of photos. (Side note, operations like spot removal and retouching brush actions are not pasteable either, which frustrates me because spot-removal is pasted from the previous when it more often than not does not align.)

    The last thing I have to say about the Photoshop matter is that there are a million Photoshop tutorial blogs. Lightroom is a newer tool with a smaller user base, and I personally came here to learn the tricks of Lightroom, not Photoshop. I have moved from Photoshop to a 99% Lightroom workflow, so I know that photoshop is not required to make awesome photos. I’d like to see blogs that help me take that to the next level within Lightroom itself.

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    • Last time I checked Adobe’s website it was called “Adobe Photoshop Lightroom”? Go Figure….?

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  188. Show how you do it. I am capable of deciding if I want to buy the plug-in or now.

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  189. Someone asked for a lesson in printing on large format printers (like an Epson 3800 in my case) from Lightroom. I second that vote!
    The blog is about Lightroom. Please show us the Lightroom way of doing things first, and then show what a plug in can do.
    By the way who is jgilbert?

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  190. I’m on the “Show us the way you do it” side. I don’t care if there are some $$ plugins or some other non lightroom related software, I watch this because I want to see how you did it.

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  191. Show us the way you do it.. You are the teacher. I’m sure you’ve experimented with many different ways of doing what you are teaching. And in the end.. you are teaching us what you feel is the BEST way to accomplish the stated goal.

    There’s a lot of information out there about Lightroom. I really don’t think that anyone would have a difficult time finding a variety of tutorials on any topic you might teach.

    I read this blog because you have earned my trust. You have credibility with me. Your teaching style is effective. I think what you teach is valuable. If you teach something that I don’t have the money to implement. Then I just file it away…

    Be yourself.. Teach what you believe.. Readers get to choose whether or not to read/watch a particular lesson. There really is no way to please everyone.

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  192. Keep doing what you want to do ! You can’t please all the people all the time.
    There are always those that would complain if you hunh them with a new rope !
    Your the MAN Matt !

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  193. Of course you should teach the way you do… We know your work, we like it, and we wanna know how it’s done… if you don’t show the way you do it, it’s not interesting… =D Way to go, Matt… keep doing the good work you’ve been doing so far ;)

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  194. How to chose? If time allowed, I’d like at least a quick run down of how to accomplish something with LR then an explanation of how using a plug in can save you time or effort and a demonstration of how YOU do it with the plug in. Even if we were to purchase the plug in, you don’t always have your own system with you and sometimes need to know to accomplish something in LR or PS from scratch. But, if you didn’t show a plug in that was a time saver and I ran across it myself or found out later that you don’t practice what you teach ;) I’d feel let down. Keep sharing, even if it’ll cost us :)

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  195. THE WAY YOU DO IT

    I get a little flutter each time your posts appear, they are a great source of inspiration, and if I have the tools to do it “like you” then its easy. If not, I USE MY BRAIN, and figure out how I can do it.

    The complaints of others are irrelevant, I have a Canon, that doesn’t stop me watching DTV and gaining more tips/tricks I can apply to my camera too.

    Keep up the excellent work.

    Josh (New Zealand)

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  196. Hi Matt,
    I follow your blog now for long long time and I think it is the perfect mixture of all. I could learn so much from you. Lightroom is really a cool software but not everything is possible with it. In my point of view it is great to see which possibilites I have with 3rd party tools and plugins.

    Please do not change anything of your teaching. It’s really great.

    greetings from germany

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  197. Matt your tips ROCK your tips on plug ins Rock too.
    Please keep up the good work, the way You do it.
    Thank You

    Dave Seattle

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  198. Dear Matt,

    the way you are doing it to me is right really, I having watching your videos for years, became a napp member attracted by the free videos, but it is the best bulk I ever invested, I went from making 0 dollars from photos to over 200 000 dollars in the last months, and most of the knowledge came from you and scott.

    for example in your last video the black and white one, I found out you are doing it exactly how Im doing it and so I didnt learn anything I also felt in love for silver fx pro from far the best best of black and white, but somehow I went to bit with more certainty and happiness to know that Im doing the same then matt, because your work is great.

    so keep going, dontchange a thing because of some comments, I would love to know how you use topaz adjust with LR for example or whatever other plugin that goes with it.

    Serge Ramelli

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  199. My vote goes to the keep doing what you are doing camp. I agree with you Matt that if all we wanted was validation on what we already know then whats the point of spending the time reading your blog. I am interested in widening my knowledge and understanding different approaches and then ultimately deciding on my own workflow!

    Keep up the good work!

    Adonis

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  200. My vote is – teach it as you do it! I personally own Nik software – but even if I didn’t – I would still want you to teach as YOU would do it. Because I think we all can learn more about what’s out there and what the pro’s use.
    Thanks for taking the time to keep your RSS feed and blog up to date..
    I love it, love your presets, love your classes.

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  201. I really enjoy reading your post and insights on Lightroom and your work-flow. My vote is for you to continue sharing with us how you use Lightroom and your work flow including 3rd party tools.

    Thank you Matt for all the time an effort you put into this site.

    Best regards,
    German

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  202. Hi Matt,

    Keep up the good work you do. I prefer videos videos – and more videos. And keep on showing integration with plug-ins, Photoshop etc.

    Karsten,

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